[menog] Peering

Mohammad W. Bazaraa Bazaraa at nesma.net.sa
Tue Jul 31 11:35:46 GMT 2007 

Team,

My information is that CITC is preparing to be the focal point between the
local DSPs in Saudi to keep local traffic local.

As far as peering with gulf, it was exist before through KACST/ISU, however
after moving this role to DSPs, STC, Bayanat & ITC will be responsible about
that and I know from the STC consultant that this is an already running
project and should be see the light very soon... 

Hope this helps... 

-------
Regards,
Mohammad Bazaraa
NESMA Internet

-----Original Message-----
From: menog-bounces at menog.net [mailto:menog-bounces at menog.net] On Behalf Of
Osama Dosary (dosary)
Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2007 12:43 PM
To: Gaurab Raj Upadhaya
Cc: menog at menog.net; Kais Al-Essa
Subject: RE: [menog] Peering

Hello,

> In my scope of work, we refer to paying for access as 
> 'transit' and if it's free access to someone else' network - 
> we refer to it as 'peering'.
> If we have a BGP running with someone - just refer to it as 
> 'bgp session' - and this bgp session can be either paid or free :-).
> 
> So, from that definition- you can't ride over someone else's 
> Layer3 network to 'peer' with someone else. You generally buy 
> raw or layer 2 capacity and run the Layer3 yourself in order 
> to peer at an IX.

The situation in Saudi is a bit confusing. Historically STC's MEIX/SIX
(no official name yet) was selling transit as I mentioned, but the one
exception was KACST/ISU which was in kind of a peering relationship
(correct me if I'm wrong Timo.) Now ISU no longer has Saudi Arabian ISPs
as their customers, only educational institutes connect to ISU, and gulf
traffic passes through transit (i.e. paid) L3 links. So STC's MEIX/SIX
is not really an IX. Basically it's a middle-east Transit ISP.

> for a gulf-wide IX and peering environment to succeed, I'd be 
> more interested to look at what transport providers are 
> present across the countries. I think this also refers back 
> to Timo's like about not enough capacity on the link.

I can't speak for STC, but at the moment there doesn't seem to be a
business case for STC to peer in the gulf. As a large portion of the
middle-east are already customers. This could be a good idea for ITC or
Bayanat.
(It terms of link capacity, its what you pay for. I don't know of any
other capacity limitations, with ISU as an exception.)

> WRT KSA, now if there are more than one international 
> gateway, it makes sense for a domestic traffic exchange.

This is exactly what CITC (Saudi regulatory authority) is planning ...
To encourage (or force) the 3 International Gateway Providers to peer
through an IX -- to keep local Saudi traffic local.

And last but not least: Thank you Gaurab for the list!

Regards,
Osama I. Al-Dosary


> Timo Liuska wrote:
> > Hi again,
> > 
> > My answer wasn't particularly clear, thanks for correcting 
> Mr. Osama. 
> > My earlier response was about the plans for national IX 
> here in KSA. 
> > STC has indeed the MEIX -project, but at least so far they haven't 
> > been able to provide enough capacity there to make it useful, so at 
> > least ISU is not peering over that link currently at all.
> > 
> > Best regards,
> > Timo
> > 
> > --
> > Timo Liuska <tic at isu.net.sa <mailto:tic at isu.net.sa>> Senior Network 
> > Consultant, Nixu Middle East FZ-LLC Network Operations Center / 
> > Internet Services Unit *King Abdulaziz City for Science & 
> Technology*
> > 
> > 
> > On Jul 31, 2007, at 11:15 , Osama Dosary ((dosary)) wrote:
> > 
> >> Hello,
> >>  
> >> I used to work in the Internet arm of STC, and as far as I 
> know STC 
> >> doesn't have any plans to peer with gulf ISPs. They have already 
> >> setup what they call "Saudi Internet Exchange", but they 
> are really 
> >> selling transit traffic to the middle-east. I believe that most of 
> >> the gulf is now connected.
> >> With regards to CITC, their plans don't include Gulf peering, 
> >> especially when that means that the content control for 
> Saudi Arabia 
> >> will be bypassed.
> >>  
> >> Since the ISU function (as an International Gateway for Saudi) has 
> >> now been integrated into STC, the doors are now open for 
> the two new 
> >> competitors to do International peering (ITC and Bayanat,) so they 
> >> could potentially peer with the gulf.
> >>  
> >> Does that answer your question?
> >>  
> >> */Regards,/*
> >> */Osama I. Al-Dosary/*
> >>  
> >>
> >>     
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------
> >>     *From:* ncc-regional-middle-east-admin at ripe.net
> >>     [mailto:ncc-regional-middle-east-admin at ripe.net] *On Behalf Of
> >>     *Timo Liuska
> >>     *Sent:* Tuesday, July 31, 2007 9:14 AM
> >>     *To:* ncc-regional-middle-east at ripe.net
> >>     <mailto:ncc-regional-middle-east at ripe.net>
> >>     *Cc:* Kais Al-Essa
> >>     *Subject:* Re: [ncc-regional-middle-east] Peering
> >>
> >>     Hi,
> >>
> >>     There has been indeed discussions about building a 
> local internet
> >>     exchange ever since the local ISP's could select where to get
> >>     their international capacity (around last Ramadan). 
> Before that,
> >>     KACST/ISU was effectively acting as an internet 
> exchange in Riyadh
> >>     and Jeddah. As far as I know, CITC is one of the key parties in
> >>     the decision process who is going to build it and 
> when. So far I
> >>     haven't seen any final decisions about it, but 
> hopefully they'll
> >>     get the decision done quickly.
> >>
> >>
> >>     Best regards,
> >>     Timo
> >>
> >>     -- 
> >>     Timo Liuska <tic at isu.net.sa <mailto:tic at isu.net.sa>>
> >>     Senior Network Consultant, Nixu Middle East FZ-LLC
> >>     Network Operations Center / Internet Services Unit
> >>     *King Abdulaziz City for Science & Technology*
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>     On Jul 26, 2007, at 21:26 , Kais Al-Essa wrote:
> >>
> >>>     Hello all,
> >>>
> >>>     It was interesting to attend the 1st MENOG meeting in Bahrain.
> >>>     I'm looking forward to such annual meetings.
> >>>
> >>>     One of the interesting topics for me as an ISP 
> Technical Manager
> >>>     is Peering Points.
> >>>
> >>>     During the meeting, I didn't see any single initiative about a
> >>>     peering project in the Gulf. However, I've heared about some
> >>>     attempts or projects, but was unable to get anything solid.
> >>>
> >>>     Therefore, I'm sending this e-mail to the group in order to
> >>>     enquire if anyone knows for sure about any peering activities
> >>>     between Gulf Countries for Internet traffic and if there is
> >>>     anything going on with Saudi Arabia in particular. I 
> personally
> >>>     heared that STC is working on something soon, but 
> again, nothing
> >>>     was solid and I was unable to obtain clear information.
> >>>
> >>>     Regards..
> >>>
> >>>     Kais Al-Essa, Founder and Operations & Technical Services 
> >>> Manager
> >>>
> >>>     Sahara Net
> >>>
> >>>     
> >>> 
> ____________________________________________________________________
> >>> ___
> >>>
> >>>     <image001.jpg>
> >>>      <http://www.sahara.com/>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> > 
> 
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